User talk:Alianin

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Changing infoboxes

You can't just make arbitrary changes to infoboxes. It's making me crazy... I have hundreds of quest pages completed, and suddenly you redesign how quest pages look? DON'T DO THAT. -- Wynthyst User Wynthyst sig iconsm.png talk 11:20, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Is the issue that I changed the infobox or that I'm reworking/expanding the quest pages? I rolled back the infobox changes and will make another quest infobox if that's the issue. The current infobox lacks some information, so I was trying to help beef it up while streamlining the page visually. The changes to the infobox I made left your current information and layout intact. This is a community resource run by the community, so I feel that we should be able to talk this out and come to an agreement if there's an issue. --Alianin 16:13, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
The issue is you just did it without any sort of discussion... as for the things you are adding? well, keeping track of what comes before and after is virtually impossible... it's how I started doing it. Also, there are virtually ZERO quests that offer xp as rewards so having a dedicated variable for that seems redundant. It's mostly a matter that while I have focused a good part of my wiki time doing quests, you have been doing other things, yet, when you decide to start on quests, you don't even bother to try to discuss it with me, you just make these sweeping changes to how the pages are presented and how the infobox works. This is a problem for me as suddenly all of the pages that I have completed look nothing like the pages you are adding. -- Wynthyst User Wynthyst sig iconsm.png talk 19:11, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
So let's discuss it now. The beauty of wikis is that there is no change done that can't be undone, redone, or pushed out.
Before and after can be tracked on the quest log. Episodes are the main ones for progression, but other quests have progression as well. The runecrafting introduction has a series of quests, for example. We don't have to have it all in there right now as you indicated before, but it makes sense to include it, no? Other contributors can add it in down the line. Crafting quests have xp gains, that's why that was included. Yes, I have my hands all over the wiki adding information because there's so much to add. In between betas I'm going through my screenshots and included in that are tons of quests, even ones that you don't have.
Regarding the changes, I did not suppress any existing information in the infoboxes, but having so much of the quest information packed into an infobox defeated the purpose of an infobox. It's to present a quick summary of key points of information, not everything to do with a quest. There's also the problem of a large void in the main space of an article because of an overly long infobox.
So now that you know where I'm coming from, can we come to some kind of compromise? I know you've devoted a lot of time on quests, but are you willing to discuss other ways of accomplishing the overall goal of the wiki which is to document the game? --Alianin 22:18, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
"Before and after can be tracked on the quest log." False. The quest log does not list quests in the order they are received/done. This is what I thought at the beginning as well, but proved it false by manually tracking with pen and paper. While there are some quests that have a real traceable progression (mostly the tradeskill quests) the story line quests really don't, or are seriously difficult to track due to the varied way they are received. There are actually reasons why I removed these things after having them initially. While not suppressing any of the information that exists in the quest pages I have already completed, you have made your "new" pages look very very different, thus killing any sense of consistency. I have purposely left information out, and left space for things to be added, but also, since the objectives change from when the quest is initially received, to when each is completed, to when the quest is completed entirely. This makes for very difficult documentation. I have mostly documented after the fact basing the page on the finished quest log entry. Quite honestly, this whole thing has kinda killed my interest, as I was already getting pretty bored with the game, and the 10 gazillion quests that gain you little. As a solo player, there is very little incentive for me to continue to play, other than the fact that I have actually PAID to play through June. I am not sure why I'm even bothering to continue this conversation. -- Wynthyst User Wynthyst sig iconsm.png talk 22:45, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Sad news

I hate to be the person to give you these news, but Wyn has passed away. As one of her co-workers here at Curse, I can tell you that we are all still in shock. As the primary admin of this wiki, we felt you should be notified as quickly as possible. In the interim, you can feel free to contact me, or Encredechine regarding any wiki business. Again, my condolences — Game widow (talk) 15:47, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

That is very sad news. :( Thank you for letting me know. --Alianin T • C 20:27, 15 May 2014 (UTC)

Infoboxes and that

Despite the sad news recently, I'm getting back to you because of these infoboxes. I've seen, you also made some copies, so we got now a couple of 'double' entries there. I also did my best with that Item-Infobox2, which looks now this way here: Volatility Rising AMP. Not to bad for me... g'd, self-praise kinda sucks!
I considered your desire to move that image/icon down and under the title, which is just fine. * BUT! * We should talk about how to reduce and consolidate these other existing boxes so it doesn't get to confusing for other users (! important).
I'd (and Gamewidow, too, of course) appreciate your help with that, since I was only playing the first Betas (okay and I'm doing a few quests now in this free Beta!), but was mostly occupied with playing "The Elder Scrolls Online" for our TESO-Wiki so far. GOOD or BAD news is, I'll be a Wildstar player too, when the game is released.
Just drop a message and we'll clean it all up. :D Encredechine (talk) 13:37, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

Sounds good and nice job with the changes. :) I'd suggesting merging the {{Item infobox2}} changes into {{Item infobox}}. In order to not break the existing infoboxes when adding the image, we can add something like this:
{{#if: {{{image|}}} | [[File:{{{image}}}|32px|{{{name|{{BASEPAGENAME}}}}}]] | [[Category:Articles missing an icon]] }}
That will make sure there's no broken image link and categorize all the items so we can go back and fix them. While we're still tweaking the item infobox, I'd like to suggest removing the Use and Label box and background formatting and let them be formatted like the rest of the tooltip in-game.
That just leaves {{Ability infobox 2}}, {{Npc infobox}}/{{NPC infobox}}, and {{Quest infobox 2}}. The duplicate ability infobox is for path abilities and such that don't have a tier upgrade. I tried to suppress that section in the main infobox with logic so we could get rid of the second one, but I kept breaking it. The lower case Npc infobox is used on vendors, but the formatting should be able to be combined with the upper case NPC infobox. The duplicate quest infobox was me trying to build in a bit more quick info for quests and moving the objectives and description to the main article space, as indicated in my conversation with Wyn above. I'd like to merge this with the main quest infobox, but I'm open to other ideas.
I look forward to working with you both and continuing what Wyn helped build. --Alianin T • C 01:00, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Sounds like a plan! We'll have a look at this and see how we can merge this all without destroying any information. No idea if you are experienced with "AutoWikiBrowser" (or AWB), but maybe Gamewidow would be willing to give us both an introduction (for me the refresher course). This is just very useful for checking and repairing masses of articles and such. Download it here: AWB on Sourceforge. Encredechine (talk) 12:08, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Yes, I'm familiar with AWB and use it on occasion, though I'm sure I don't know everything there is to know about it. How do we want to divide up the work and proceed and with what changes? --Alianin T • C 13:37, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Aye, I've been talking with Gamewidow and she thinks this is all very reasonable what you said. So we'll try to tweak this and if you see still something necessary to be changed, we can have another look (or you also can give it a try, of course). The other thing is looking for missing categories and to add new ones if still needed, so everything will get in it's place. Expect a clean up the next days or so concerning that matter. :D
Oh, if you got questions about AWB, Gamewidow is your best partner in this. She uses it pretty frequently and knows a trick or two. Can't hide my amazement.Encredechine (talk) 13:57, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Howdy, sorry but i've been bogged down with another project. I've been reading this section and speaking with Encredechine and i have a couple of questions regarding the npc infoboxes. So, here we go: From what i can tell, all you really wanted to add was the header background for the infobox title, a section heading for the statistics and and a typeicon on the infobox title header. Is that correct? and if so, that leads to question 2: i noted that you put the type icon to the right of the infobox title. For the original infobox, the factionicon is to the left, does that mean you if an npc has both a faction and a type you'd like the infobox title to be flanked by those two icons ? if so, that's very doable. If you could let me know, that would be great. — Game widow (talk) 13:22, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Not sure, Wyn set up the Npc infobox used for vendors originally and I just went with it. I think if we flanked the title by the two icons, it should be good. --Alianin T • C 16:46, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
OK, Then that's what i'll do, then sweep the wiki to make sure only the NPC infobox (improved) version is used, then delete npc infobox. Agreed ? — Game widow (talk) 17:29, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good to me! --Alianin T • C 17:57, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Just to be totally sure, this means that you want an image in every NPC infobox, right ? — Game widow (talk) 18:38, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Do you mean an image of the NPC or an icon or both? Yes to all the above. :) --Alianin T • C 19:05, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
When i asked the question, i was thinking of just the npc image, but you're right, all of them, and now they are all there .. though clearly we need to get some npc images now. — Game widow (talk) 19:12, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Curiosity

On pages like Sergeant Syrrus, what is the purpose of that 4px wide column between the icon and the next column ? — Game widow (talk) 19:58, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Again, that's something that was already in play when I started using it. I think it's for number of items for stacks like consumables. --Alianin T • C 20:18, 18 May 2014 (UTC)